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This thread is in response to a review for God of War III on the PlayStation 3. You are encouraged to view the article in a new window before reading this thread.

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zippdementia Always bring a book March 19, 2010 (08:50 PM)

Hey, this is an awesome review, Zig (though it almost feels cliche to say that to a Zig review). I really like the approach you took. You didn't waste time explaining God of War or Kratos (cause what's the point?) and come at the game from a more critical view point, asking "hey, haven't we seen this before?" It's easy to get wrapped up in the, well, wrapping that comes along with the God of War series. I, like you, have always loved the first game. The next two in the main series felt always like the first game only not as new. I think you've nailed the one flaw of the GOW series and you've done it without stretching for little things that would make this an unenjoyable experience. Indeed, you say it is enjoyable (and it is) but you are critical of all the right things. Except maybe you should've bitched about the jumping ^_^ It keeps killing me, !@#$!...

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Stu_J General User March 21, 2010 (11:38 AM)

I really felt the need to register on this site just to comment on your review. So if your aim was to gain members and traffic by purposely writing a turgid and utterly misguided piece of drek then mission accomplished. I'm curious, what was it about the game that made you feel it dissappointed? You are comparing No More Heroes 2 on the Wii to this game? Really look at that statement really think about what you are saying. IN this game they've introduced tweaks and fixes the small number of issues that resided within the first two games. It's one of the most beautiful games ever created, graphics and scale are just mind blowing. To give it 7 is utterly astonishing. This isn't an attack on you personally god knows everyone is entitled to their opinion but you are simply wrong, i concede people could maybe stretch to giving this game 8.9 or 9 due to familiarity but 7?!?!? Yes it's the same type of game as the first two, you were expecting what exactly? Unchartered 2 which I loved and critics adored was exactly the same as the first. Which reminds me, there so many new types of control and camera angles that the game just shines out amongst the samey, generic bullcrap out today. I'm not a fanboy both consoles on the market (the wii is nothing more than a child's plaything) But you clearly must be, either that or this game really isn't your thing. The thing that really ticks me off is that your crappy review is knocking the accumulated score of the game which deserves far far more! Please stop.

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wolfqueen001 Furry Face March 21, 2010 (11:48 AM)

Ugh. Here it comes. The rampage of the N4G Playstation 3 fanboys. We are in every right to write a review based on our opinions of a game. Just because these opinions don't agree with the so-called "majority" doesn't make them any less valid. Indeed, it makes them more valid because they're willing to point out flaws that a non-biased individual looking to perfect a game would appreciate. I would rather read a review honestly critiquing a game for its merits than a nothing-but-praise joke that doesn't discuss any issues that someone can potentially have. For example, if I read a 10/10 GoWIII review saying nothing but "lol Kratos is awesum! I love his super gorey attacks and magicks!" then bought the game expecting nothing but only to find that it does contain some inconvenient features (i.e. awkward jumping) then I'd be heartily disappointed in both the review and the reviewer. So go away please if you can't open your mind to other people's opinions and accept the fact that not everyone who writes something contrasting your own views has some sort of secret agenda.

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zigfried (Mod) Yaranai ka? March 21, 2010 (11:49 AM)

No More Heroes 2? What are you talking about? I did not mention No More Heroes 2. I did mention Bayonetta in one short sentence as an example of what this game is not. Some people may interpret that as an insult, but for people who disliked the craziness of Bayonetta, it's a compliment. Perhaps you read the wrong review entirely and mistook it for mine. Since the review you read was "an utterly misguided piece of drek", that's likely the case. I desperately try not to write those. The purpose of this review was not to garner hits through shock and awe. I assure you that I would be much more shocking and . . . awe-ful . . . if that were the case. The purpose of this review was to express my opinion of a new game while that opinion is still relevant to potential buyers. My enjoyment of God of War 3 was certainly less than the first game, possibly less than the second, and the game presents content that has become tired and -- more importantly -- so unnecessary that it desecrates what once was special. You discuss scores as though they can somehow be "right" or "wrong". If you look here, you will see that the average user review rating for the original God of War is 8.4. If you look here, you will see that the average user review rating for God of War 2 is an 8. Taking those progressively declining ratings of 8.4 and 8.0 into account, how exactly is it that a game which is not as good and certainly not as interesting, must objectively score an 8.9 or higher? Are you seriously saying it deserves a high score because it's beautiful? There are a lot of beautiful games out there. It's very easy to become acclimated to beauty. That's why the best "beautiful" games keep raising the bar as the adventure progresses. God of War 3 does not. I'm going to pretend you did not actually cite "new [computer-controlled] camera angles" as a reason for awarding this game a high score. Regarding "so many new types of control", I suggest you go back and play the original God of War for a refresher on what is new and what is not. Even better, I suggest you expand your horizons and play more action-adventure games in general. You'll not only discover that God of War 3 isn't special, but you'll also spend your time in a far more productive manner than registering for websites simply to express the tired opinion of: "pretty games deserve high scores". //Zig

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Stu_J General User March 21, 2010 (12:08 PM)

As I mentioned I'm not a 'Fanboy' I own both a 360 and a PS3. I happen to enjoy as many series' on the 360 such as Mass Effect, Halo and Fable just as much as any on the PS3. The fact that he didn't give it 10 isn't the issue. He certainly isn't the only one not to give it a full 10. It's the 7/10, this and you'll be lieing if you don't concede that this is true, is a score reserved for run of the mill titles, your typical generic hack slashers for example. To say that it's too much like the previous game is a backward remark, it has no gravity or sense in reviewing a game which is the third of a triology . Things were never going to get radically different, i feel that done enough to keep it fresh and intense throughout. 7/10 is an insult to such a polished game that has very few flaws. To be so stubborn in the reviewing of a game is not a strong trait for any critic. Lord knows the one thing you MUST possess is a sense of fairness and this review simply isn't fair. I assume then that every single sequel including final fantasy, pokemon or any other game that even slightly mimics its predecessors will be heavily marked down. The puzzles were as interesting and at times difficult as the previous titles, the gameplay far superiour to both games, an accomplishment in itself. Everything about the graphics has already been commented by every reviewer on the fucking planet. It's not simply a matter of camera angles. The first game as you seem to adore was fundamentally flawed in the gameplay department. Gliches were many and the lack of any useful powerups made the sense of accomplishment less than it really should have been. That being said it's still an incredible game. The second edited and fixed these issues and whilst not perfect it's certainly up there. The third once again does the same. I mention No more heroes becuase you have that game a 7 in a separate review, to even have those two games on the same platform for scores is ridiculous. The average score according to gamerankings by the way is 9.2 or 92 depending on your reviewing scale. Making your poultry 7 seem all the more ridiculous. You can think me a fanboy if you must, but if this series and this game was a 360 exclusives I'd be blurting out the same hyperbolic praise as i am now. A laughably amateurish review.

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honestgamer (Mod) Editor-in-Cheese March 21, 2010 (12:12 PM)

Hi, Stu! Thanks for sharing your feedback for the review. Contrary to what seems to be the going opinion over at N4G, we don't score the games that we review on HonestGamers with some secret agenda of steering people away from the PlayStation 3 and we don't post them to lure N4G folks to post on our site. We score games the way we do because we feel that they deserve them. What would you think of God of War III if it played precisely the way it does except that the graphics were completely unmemorable? Judging by your comments, you would enjoy it a good deal less. That's something our reviews tend to speak to. Games get uglier over time and then you're left with what lies beneath the shiny, polished surface. Your comments imply that you could understand the game perhaps going as low as a 9/10, which is frankly an absurd statement. A '9' isn't a low score. It's an exceptionally high score, especially since a score of 5 is the average. Did you stop to consider that maybe not everyone will think that this game is one of the greatest of all time? Apparently not. But this isn't really even about score. This is a case where one of us--the guy that reviewed it, not necessarily the whole site--didn't like a game that you did. You're concerned about us bringing down the average because that might prevent the PlayStation army from growing, because you see this review--and perhaps this site--as some sort of attempt to nullify any weapons that Sony has with which to fight this grand console war. We, on the other hand, see games as games. We play them on all systems and we recognize that no genre is exclusive to one platform. A reference to No More Heroes 2 would be perfectly reasonable when provided within the proper context, even though Wii's graphics aren't as good as PlayStation 3's graphics. Think about that for a minute. We're covering games as games, regardless of platform. A game either is worth playing or it isn't. We're here to say whether or not individual games meet that criteria. God of War III, as it so happens, does meet that criteria... but that doesn't mean that it gets a pass on the things that it does wrong. We'll continue to point those things out in the games that we review and we'll continue to rate them accordingly. If you really have a lot to say on the subject and you're capable of organizing your thoughts into a quality review, we have a lovely user reviews section and would welcome your perspective. In the meantime, continue enjoying God of War III. I haven't played it yet but it looks like it could be pretty sweet.

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This message was deleted at the request of zigfried, the person who originally posted it.

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Stu_J General User March 21, 2010 (12:32 PM)

"But this isn't really even about score. This is a case where one of us--the guy that reviewed it, not necessarily the whole site--didn't like a game that you did. You're concerned about us bringing down the average because that might prevent the PlayStation army from growing, because you see this review--and perhaps this site--as some sort of attempt to nullify any weapons that Sony has with which to fight this grand console war." Utterly untrue! I have no bias either way, the reason I am annoyed it's bringing the score down is because I happen to think it deserves such a high score as the majoirty of reviewers have been giving it. It' has jack all to do with PS3 or xbox360. It's annoying to see such a hard working team such as Santa Monica get their efforts knocked by a review, especially if I find that review to be uninformed and misguided in how it judges said game. Also I don't go onto N4G don't know where that's coming from, you guys clearly have some sort of beef with the PS3 but frankly I'm not bothered. The truth and the majority of sensible reviews will rise to the top.

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zigfried (Mod) Yaranai ka? March 21, 2010 (12:39 PM)

Reviews are for expressing opinions and informing consumers about final products, not for rewarding the effort that went into that product. The final product is a good game, better than Darksiders, but significantly short of the inspired excellence that would earn a high rating from me. Clearly, you believe that God of War 3 is excellent. Based on Gamerankings' all-time top ten list, I presume that you also believe Grand Theft Auto 4 to be even more excellent. I'm afraid we'll have to disagree on both counts. //Zig

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honestgamer (Mod) Editor-in-Cheese March 21, 2010 (01:07 PM)

Sorry, I sort of leapfrogged from someone else's assumption and I shouldn't have done that. We tend to hear from N4G folk whenver we post a review for a PS3 game that rates it below a 9 (or sometimes a 10), so I hope you'll understand why the assumption was likely made in the first place. I agree that it can sting to see a game that you love receive a low score from an outlet that seems to have missed the point, but I don't believe that to be a case here. Our reviewer has a history with and strong knowledge of the series, as well as a solid appreciation of what it can do right (and what it has done right in the past). There's no one better to evaluate the quality of this newest installment. Personally, I wish nothing but the best for the people who work to make games. I respect their efforts and I appreciate them, as does Zigfried. At the end of the day, though, this isn't an elementary school where everyone in contention gets a ribbon or consolation prize. Blockbuster games come out at $60 and when consumers are asked to part with that money for a game, they deserve to know just what to expect. They don't want to hear that they should buy a game because the developers tried hard. They need to hear that the game kicks ass and provides $60 worth of entertainment, and they need to know when it doesn't. The focus for HonestGamers reviews is simple: we want to let readers know whether or not the game being reviewed is worth its asking price. We want to provide a review that gives information so that the reader can know whether he or she in particular is likely to enjoy the title. We're not concerned with what other critics thought about the game. We're concerned with what we think and we're going to do our best to explain why in a manner that allows the reader to say "I'd probably feel the same way" or "He was bothered by things that wouldn't bother me so I'd probably like it more than he did." My thanks for your earlier comments was sincere. We aren't striving for violent reactions to our reviews, or even gushing praise. We're trying to foster open, honest discussion about games and reviews. I'm sorry if it seemed otherwise.

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zippdementia Always bring a book March 21, 2010 (02:02 PM)	Stu, I love the fact that someone disagrees strongly enough with a review to come over here and post. Why don't you write a review of the game yourself and then you can even-out the score for the game? That seems the most productive use of your time. That is, if you actually care about this issue and aren't just typing for the fun of exercising your fingers.
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Suskie THIS HURTS YOU March 21, 2010 (02:08 PM)

And so it starts. I don't know why you guys are wasting your time trying to reason with this guy. Have you no understanding of fanboy logic? Stu, you're going to have to face the fact that whether you like it or not, you are a fanboy, if not of PS3, then of God of War III. A more sensible (and older) person would realize that the accumulated GameRankings average for God of War III has no effect whatsoever on one's ability to enjoy the game. Though I'll give you credit for being more straightforward than the Uncharted 2 guy, who actually tried to act intelligent. I'd keep talking, but I'm already in danger of giving this guy more attention than he's worth. Y'all are way ahead of me.

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pickhut Mad Onion! March 21, 2010 (02:32 PM)	Hey, did someone mention Bayonetta in this topic? :D Cool game. "The fact that he didn't give it 10 isn't the issue." "...the reason I am annoyed it's bringing the score down is because I happen to think it deserves such a high score as the majoirty of reviewers have been giving it." ???
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wolfqueen001 Furry Face March 21, 2010 (02:50 PM)

That's why these people are so cute, pickhut; they never realize they're contradicting themselves. Anyway, I finally read the review, Zig. Nice work. This is exactly the kind of review I was looking for since I found myself wondering, upon the third release, just how samey the game was going to be compared to the others. I remember starting GoWII a while back and beating probably not even a quarter of it before my controllers decided to be gay and not work properly, thus making timed platforming things impossible. Through all that, I felt that the game seemed almost exactly like the first only now Kratos is fighting for the titans, he seems to lack some of his more awesome combos from the first game, and they introduced some (admittedly awesome) Pegasus and Colossus elements. Now, I'm not sure how GoWWII concludes and probably won't until I can buy some new controllers, but through that whole experience, I was kind of just waiting for the sort of empty feeling like "alright, when's something new going to happen" kicked in. That being said, I can't be certain how disappointed I would've been, or even was until that point, or how it would have affected my opinion of the game, but I did get the same sentiment that you seemed to in this third installment. It's all just good to know. So thanks.

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Genj General User March 21, 2010 (02:56 PM)	Zig's allowed to give it as low as an 8.9, pickhut.
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Suskie THIS HURTS YOU March 21, 2010 (03:23 PM)	I'm not sure how GoWWII concludes God of World War II?
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Ben Sonic Flash March 21, 2010 (04:01 PM)	This is not directed at everyone in this thread, but: A person can disagree with a review if he wants to. He might have been slightly harsh with his words in his first post and his argument may be a little thin, but what is so wrong with enjoying a game?
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Suskie THIS HURTS YOU March 21, 2010 (04:18 PM)	I'm not even getting into this with you, Ben. His opinion is irrelevant. It's how he's acting about it that's getting him shot at.
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Felix_Arabia Missisquoi Bay March 21, 2010 (04:19 PM)	Stu_J, your handle is pronouncd as "stooge.". Think about that.
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zigfried (Mod) Yaranai ka? March 21, 2010 (05:09 PM)

Ben -- There's nothing wrong with enjoying a game, whether others consider it to be great, good, or bad. I imagine everyone here has their own reason behind whatever they said, and that includes Stu. In my case, he called my review utterly misguided, amateurish, drek, and asked me to please stop. If I register on another site and insult a review, I would fully expect the author to defend his own work. Even moreso if I asked them to stop writing. (That doesn't mean I've never insulted people, and I'm not calling Stu evil or anything like that... I'm saying it makes sense for authors to stand up for their own work) I don't know if I'm one of the people you're referring to, so perhaps this entire explanation is unnecessary... my goal was not to tear down a game he loves (I don't believe I did) but to respond to a blatant attack. The high road can be very dull, especially when I've spent the morning trying to remove a squirrel from my basement and need to vent. Yes, the squirrel is still there. //Zig

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radicaldreamer General User March 21, 2010 (06:03 PM)

A person can disagree with a review if he wants to. He might have been slightly harsh with his words in his first post and his argument may be a little thin, but what is so wrong with enjoying a game? I deleted my first post because I was afraid of undermining the tolerant and reasonable space that Jason and Zig are trying to create, but the fact of the matter is that this is exactly what this guy is not doing. He thinks his opinion (which is also the opinion of the majority) is fact, and he's not allowing Zig to disagree with him or give it the score that Zig thinks it deserves.

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zippdementia Always bring a book March 21, 2010 (06:13 PM)	I originally wrote a post that pointed out all the contradictions in Stooge's arguements, but I ultimately decided, as well, that I would rather give the guy a chance to actually write a review and put all this bashing energy to better use. Chances are it won't work and Suskie will be proved right, but tolerance is never a poor virtue to have.
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Genj General User March 21, 2010 (07:36 PM)	Zig, the old fashioned spring-loaded rat/mouse traps are not very humane, but with a bit of peanut butter should take care of your squirrel. Yes, I know this from experience.
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Ben Sonic Flash March 21, 2010 (07:55 PM)

I didn't intend to have a go with my post. Sorry if it came across that way. Honestly, I'm not siding with Stu, and it's actually nice to see that people have each other's back. I was just surprised that so many had come to Zig's defence given that Stu's comments were directed at Zig. Some responses were constructive, and that's fine, but a couple seemed to be fueling the fire. Zig - My post wasn't aimed at you at all. You certainly have the right to respond to any criticism as the author of this review. I'd do the same in your situation, so don't worry about it.

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